You’ll remember that in the fall of 2024, the FS said that no temporaries would be hired for the summer of 2025, due to a budget deficit. The budget deficit was $750 mill, I had heard. Why did the deficit happen? I think it’s still relevant today because the numbers added in the last few years (5400) compared to the numbers lost (6K or so) don’t seem as different as the real pain units are feeling. So there are probably deeper layers to this story. Maybe only that the additions were not as vital as those who left via voluntary reductions, but even so..
At the Retiree Reunion in Missoula last fall, Chief Moore talked about it, and I thought it was interesting. You can see what he had to say on this video right around 1:38:28. It’s better to hear Randy talking, but for those who want, I took the Youtube transcript and did some editing for clarity and spelling.
Actually if you are interested in the Forest Service, hearing all the Chiefs talk and reminisce about their time is interesting. You can even download the Youtube and listen in the car or wherever. We can discuss in the comments. Anyway, back to Chief Moore. I am a big Chief Moore fan, and the venue of his retirement stories and celebration was not the place to get all the details. He’s painting a big picture and the broad sweep of events, which isn’t the same as a budget powerpoint or even a briefing paper.
My questions about his comments at the Retiree’s Reunion do not reflect at all on his legacy and leadership. I’m still trying to put the pieces together, and ask a question “were there other ways to reduce the deficit than reduce employee numbers? Or was the plan to continue into deficit?” One of the problems in finding this out was a complete lack of information from recent retirees. I have only heard second and third hand whispers, which is decidedly unusual for such an important issue. There have been no apparent leaks to the media or perhaps the media were not interested. If someone can help piece this together, it would be greatly appreciated.
Anyway, back to Randy’s talk:
This is my last statement. But I remember with Secretary Vilsack and he called us over and he wants to talk about what we were going to do because we’re going to be getting bipartisan infrastructure legislation and the inflation reduction act monies and the Forest Service got 10 billion dollars of those monies and we needed to do something with it, and so we were asked to develop a 10-year plan, and so we developed a 10-year plan is known as the Wildfire Crisis Strategy and we had 10 years to spend that money. Well, the election was coming around. We probably had to speed it up.
Back to history, the Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act (IIJA) was signed into law on November 15, 2021, and the Inflation Reduction Act (IRA) was passed on August 16, 2022, just nine months later. As we know, the Wildfire Crisis Strategy was developed in 2022.
It sounds like they felt they needed to spend all the 10 years worth of money in case the funding was retracted by Congress? Or maybe the election he mentions was the 2024 Presidential election?
And so what we did was that and it was at Secretary Vilsack’s request is that he said, you know, Chief, he says, we either got too much land or not enough money.
Now the FS did receive a substantial chunk of change from the IRA and the IIJA, although not all of it was for NFS and even then some was rather odd. I can’t find it right now, but I did a post on the numbers in the IRA.(e.g $100 mill for improving NEPA efficiency, not actually doing NEPA). I did two searches from different AIs and got different numbers for how much the FS received in IIJA and IRA funds, so gave up.
I said, we don’t have enough money, Mr. Secretary. And he said, well, no. He says, um, how much would you say that we’re doing based compared to what we’re being asked? And so we sent this around to all the regional foresters and station directors. And you, you all know us, you know, when you ask a question like that, we don’t always tell the complete truth when we respond back because here’s what came back. and and they were telling the truth. so I you know it was the real truth, but we get appropriated about $6 billion. When we looked at what we were being asked to do in the budget that we would need, it was about $33 billion.
So we were doing somewhere around 19% we were funded 19% of what we were being asked to do. And all of you probably know that, you know, because you people retire, you did their job and yours, you know, it just went cycle, cycle, cycle, you know, and and and so that was the first revealing piece is that we were underfunded and we’re being asked to do more and more and more, with less and less and less and it and it turned out to be truthful when we looked at what we’re being asked to do versus where we’re being funded.
But maybe IIJA and IRA added a bunch of bucks..so was it “less and less” at that point?
And so took that over to the Secretary. So he said, um, $33 billion. And I said, that’s that’s the answer to your question. And so he said, what if we just doubled what you had from 6 billion to 12 billion. I said, okay, we’ll do about 40% of what we’re being asked to do, but we needed to be grateful if we could get another $6 billion. That would be great. And so the Secretary Vilsack was making a move to do that with OPM
To put it in the President’s Budget Request?
and we ran out of time. But here’s what happened. We developed a plan because and we couldn’t in good conscience ask the workforce to do $10 billion more worth of work when we were clearly being underfunded. And so we hired 5,000 additional employees in the agency.
And you know us once we get going, we are very successful. We actually hired about 5,400 people, you know, we didn’t have a governor in there, you know. We it didn’t it didn’t just stop, you know. So 5,400 people.
And so when you talk about what the Forest Service was behind, it was never $700 million, what was mentioned. It was about $500 million. But here’s the thing. Our plan, we had 10 years to spend that money. More like eight years to spend that money. On the average, we lost about 2,000 employees a year through attrition. So, we know that at worst, we could reach that 5,000 employees over two and a half, three years. And that’s what we were looking at doing, but we needed to hire a lot of people to do that additional work that we’re being asked to do. And so, that’s why we hired the additional 5,000 people.
This seems to agree with the story “not enough people retired as we imagined” but with a different twist than “our model for retirement was wrong.” It also has the addition “we planned for them to retire over more years but we felt an urgency to hire lots more people .” It would also make sense to have some kind of “governor” in the system so agencies don’t overhire. At the same time, we remember mucho bucks being obligated to an array of the usual suspect Keystone and other NGOs, as well as ..others (the National Baptists.. for work in.. Arizona?).
Now, we had also needed to look at diversity. And so a part of what we did was try and move into areas that we have not been commonly moved into. And so of that 5,300 people, we had a lot of diversity, gender and ethnicity. And believe it or not, we went from a 18% diversity up to about 27- 28% diversity. And that was that was a record by far. and we moved the gender from about 34 to about 43. Now, what’s interesting is that now the 5,000 people that have left or lost their jobs represent the diversity and inclusion that we had reached through that effort. And I say this, I want to say that diversity and inclusion matters because a lot of the young people, a lot of our young people had the skill set to move us into this direction that I mentioned earlier. carbon sequestration, looking at developing a carbon standard, looking at our research and our science, looking at wood innovations that was what was represented in that 5,300 employees that we hired. And that’s what is being jeopardized with this latest move.
This was confusing to me when I heard it, as news stories in March said the probationary folks were being reinstated, and the Reunion was in . So who left? It appears that it was a mix of the newly hired but lots of older experienced folks. Some of the probationaries were field- working conversions from temporaries, but others had positions less directly involved with field work. At the time, field folks were complaining that the funding was being used to staff up ROs or hire chiefs of staff. I have seen recently hired hitherto unnecessary positions myself at GS-12 levels.
And just to make one point, there have been plenty of excellent people who know about carbon sequestration and carbon stuff in the FS for … at least 20 years.
As a female forester hired in 1979, I that if this is 2025 and the % women in the FS was at 34, there might be structural issues involved.. like if most of the budget is in wildfire, and wildfire folks have a smaller percentage of women, then.. we need to consider that. If fire has had trouble getting their numbers up.. does that mean everyone else has to have 70% women to balance out for the agency totals?
Inquiring minds might still wonder… was the deficit $750 or $500 mill? Why did the FS intentionally hire on more permanents than it could afford? What was the hurry to spend the money really about? What was the long-term plan for the Harris folks to have dealt with the over-hiring problem? Perhaps playing chicken with Congress and blaming future RIFs on not enough funding? Or maybe not having temporaries for more field seasons?
And what was the story with the Keystones and other large sums in grants- grantees who were hiring temp folks for positions that had formerly been permanent employees? And why has it been so hard to find out these things? There have been no leaks, no retirees speaking out, and no traditional media interest. It may have something to do with why the Trump Admin reductions have been so difficult and newsworthy for the FS, and not so much for other land management agencies.